There is a very enlightening article in the YU Comentator, that reports on a meeting between Rosh Kollel Hershel Schachter (RHS) and Yeshiva College Dean David Srolovitz (DDS). Much of the discussion revolves around what is appropriate subject matter to be offered in a University that is part of a Yeshiva and whether this has hindered some students from attending YU.
What is fascinating about this article is to see what the curriculum was… and is… and the perspective of Rav Schachter on this issue and on other related ones as well. It should be noted that many subjects in YU are controversial in the Torah world, and might seem inappropriate for Frum students to study.
It should also be noted that Dr. Bernard Revel, from the very beginning insisted that the institutution that he founded offered those courses because of his insistence on creating a real university which he believed, (correctly in my view… certainly for that time) would be the only way of keeping the better students from leaving the Yeshiva and going to a completely secular university full time. This meant allowing academic freedom. When asked how he could allow potential Apikursus, his response was that the Bachurim were well prepared to deal with it on the Yeshiva side… and they would be able to distinguish between what is and isn’t Apikursus when confronted with it in the classroom.
Bearing this in mind, here are some of (mostly) Rav Shachter's words taken from that article:
The Commentator(TC): In light of the recent departure of students from Yeshiva College, should YC alter aspects of their curriculum to satisfy students?
Rabbi Schachter: I remember 50 years ago when students who were coming from the Telshe Yeshiva in Cleveland - against Rabbi Gifter's advice - would ask 'Why are you going to Yeshiva? To study the gospels? And they're still studying the Gospels here. There is no reason why they have to teach the Gospels. There is so much literature in the world, why teach the Gospels?
Nowadays everyone goes to college even students from Torah V'Daas. You have to go to college. But students go to Touro or wherever. They should go to Yeshiva College. We should make it comfortable for all students. (Some students) are not going to come because of theological reasons. Why shouldn't we make it comfortable for all students to come and attend Yeshiva? Why shouldn't we allow students to come to Yeshiva without studying the Gospels? …It would be a good idea when you have a course where certain things from the Gospels are taught, that a religious Jew should teach it, as opposed to a Christian minister or a non observant Jew.
TC: How would you respond to a student who feels uncomfortable studying academic Bible?
Dean David Srolovitz: Some parts of academic Bible, like putting what you're reading into the context of the society of the time and looking at it in linguistic terms is, I think, a healthy thing for students. … (O)ur mission is primarily secular in nature.
RHS: When I was in college, the rabbis taught Tanach (Bible). Now, in recent years, the college has introduced more academic Bible. The students in IBC are taking Tanach …and don't have to worry about taking academic Bible. However, students in other programs are stuck taking academic Bible when they want to hear more traditional Tanach.
TC: Many students feel that the intensity of a rigorous dual curriculum prevents them from maximizing their potential in either section of the day. How should such a student resolve this problem?
RHS: They used to have a 5-6 year program where they wouldn't charge extra for taking courses and only charge for using the dormitory. We should popularize that now. Everyone is in such a rush at the age of 18 to get out of college. …They are just fooling themselves in to thinking that they are accomplishing something. They are not.
TC: How should Yeshiva College approach the teaching of literature?
RHS: We should notify the teachers that this is a Jewish institution and they therefore have to be careful not to teach literature which is inappropriate or avodah zara. I was once asked how we should teach literature and I said "It's not easy. You have to pick out the things that are Kosher."
DDS: How do you teach Chaucer?
RHS: I don't know if you have to teach Chaucer.
DDS: Chaucer …is part of the canon of a liberal arts education. …I would imagine that there is very little that can not be taught if it is taught in the right way
RHS: Chaucer is part of the canon of world literature but that canon is so vast. You are not going to be able to study every part of it. Whatever a university will offer, there will always be more to study.
DDS: There is a sense of what an educated English major needs to have at his finger tips. There is an assumption in graduate schools, that students are familiar with basics like Chaucer. …We are a university and a yeshiva. When students sign up, they know that they are coming to a university too.
RHS: It has been the tradition here since time immemorial that many types of courses are offered at the college. The problem is that many students come in and think that many courses are approved by the rabbis. They don't realize that none of the courses are approved by the rabbis. Students return from Israel and don't realize whether a course is questionable. …I personally feel that it is a problem that it is offered. The deans have always said that Dr. Revel had it and Dr. Belkin had it and I think that it wasn't right since day number one. But at least we should make the school comfortable for students who are not interested in taking these things in classes.
DDS: Would you and your colleagues agree that certain subjects are always inappropriate under all circumstances?
RHS: I would have to consult them. (But) I don't think such a small number of lines (from e.g. the New Testament) for just a historical purpose is a problem.
TC: Is it appropriate for a student to treat Yeshiva College as a trade school?
RHS: When I was a student, Torah u-Madda under Dr. Belkin did not mean as much as it does today. Rabbi Belkin wanted to provide a more available yeshiva and college and environment than City College. What's wrong if a student treats college as a trade school? Just let him. We should make him feel comfortable. You won't be changing the nature of the college. That's the question: should you accept such a student whose head is screwed on differently because he believes in Torah u-Parnasa - I don't think you need to reject him for that. Why should we chase away students? They are coming to this school and participating in this college. We do not need to keep on emphasizing that we are Torah u-Madda and not Torah u-Parnasa. We should allow all students to feel comfortable in attending YU.
TC: Should works be censored in a Yeshiva College Art History course?
RHS: Fifty percent they can teach but I don't understand how they can teach the other half - it's avodah zara and gilui arayot (licentiousness). There was a professor here years ago who claimed that there was a difference between nakedness and nudity - I think they both do not belong here. I find it very offensive that such a thing is even offered. …(Q)uestions come up every year where students come over to me complaining how they took a problematic Bible course with such and such a professor ... or complaining about a sociology course.
DDS: The only way to change this is to do deal with these things upfront and where people are willing to deal with these controversial matters in public. …If I say that academic freedom is more important than anything else - that's what people expect the dean of Yeshiva College to say. Similarly, people will expect to hear a certain type of approach coming from a rosh yeshiva. We need to work together on these issues.
